The Reality Of The Surveillance State | Retrospect Ep.237

In this week’s episode we discussed the rise of the surveillance state and what it means for privacy, freedom, and everyday life. From government data collection to corporate tracking, we unpack how monitoring has become embedded in modern society, and the trade-offs we’re often asked to accept. We examine the history, the technology, and the critical questions shaping our digital future.

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Surveillance state, government monitoring, digital currency, dynamic pricing, data collection, privacy concerns, AI systems, facial recognition, consumer data, Maryland law, North Carolina law, digital privacy, government regulation, social score, personal security., Surveillance state, security cameras, video doorbells, AI features, facial recognition, privacy concerns, license plate readers, law enforcement abuse, home security, peace of mind, data collection, update control, compliance rules, system updates, future control.Jason  
Sits in your pocket. It listens from your kitchen counter. It watches from street corners, store fronts, traffic lights, quiet, patient, always on, no knock, no warning, no moment where anyone said, this is the line, because the surveillance state didn't rise like a storm spread like a fog. You don't feel it moving in until you realize you can't see without it. We used to imagine this future in black and white, grainy cameras, shadowy agents, secret files, stamped classified, something out of George Orwell's 1984 but that version was almost comforting, at least in that world you knew who was watching today, it's not just governments. It's corporations, algorithms, strangers and yes, sometimes it's you, every search, every swipe, every pause on a video, not just recorded, interpreted patterns, built profiles, sharpened decisions made about you before you even make them yourself. And here's the twist. No one likes to admit it works. Criminal complaints are resolved faster. Packages arrive before you remember ordering them. Your phone knows what you want before you say it out loud. Convenience isn't the byproduct. It's the bait, because control doesn't feel like control when it's dressed as comfort. And somewhere along the way, we stopped asking who has the power and started asking, How much does it make my life easier? That's the trade, not forced, not stolen, offered and accepted. So tonight, we're not just asking whether we're being watched. We're asking something heavier. When did we stop resisting and start participating? Because the scariest part of the surveillance state isn't that it exists, it's that it no longer needs permission. It just needs you to keep pressing accept.

Ian  
Welcome to retrospect, podcast, a show where people come together from different walks of life and discuss a topic from their generations perspective. My name is Ian, and is always been joined by Stoney, hello and Jason.

Jason  
Hello, everyone. How's

Ian  
it going?

Jason  
Well? I heard a big boom of thunder

Stoney   
that was almost perfect timing that could have happened during my closing

Jason  
you know, it's, uh,

Ian  
yeah,

Jason  
we have gotten, we have gotten some rain in this area, quite a bit today. I mean, it's, it's been pouring down. But what kind of a bit of a drought? So I'm actually the rain. I actually like it, because my rain barrels start filling back up. I have my rain water. I used to water, yeah, water my plant. So I like it when Mother Nature decides to

Ian  
give you a little

Jason  
to give me a little bit of, a little bit of, you know, some juice to work with. So,

Ian  
and you said it's supposed to get super cold again.

Jason  
Well, it's cold. For this area, that's, that's below normal, actually. So I'm just curious if this new super El Nino is going to have it a wonder, if that's kind of one of the byproducts for for this area.

Jason  
Yeah, you have, you know, cooler hemps later in the spring versus, you know, usually by this time, oh yeah, it's warm. It's pretty warm,

Ian  
don't, don't get me wrong, it's been warm a little bit, but it usually stays warm after this. And that's the part that gets that's why I said the work. That's why I said cold. I was like, I mean, it's cold in in regards to what we're used to in beginning of May,

Jason  
oh, yeah,

Ian  
40 degrees, that's unheard

Jason  
that's

Jason  
quite unheard of. Actually, I'm a shock when I saw that. I was like, Well, enjoy it while it lasts. I just feel like this, this might be, this might be the last bit of a of winter saying, Okay, I'm still here, but I'm getting ready to vacate the premises.

Stoney   
Elvis

Jason  
has left.

Jason  
Yeah, the sun is going to be, you know, full out, and the heat's going to be going up. And luckily, because I had my air conditioned service today, just okay to spend some money to keep an older unit going. So especially

Ian  
during this time, like the last thing you want to start to go out,

Jason  
man, that's what I worry about. You know, I'm, you know, you can't have that happen when it's 98 degrees outside and and I'll just have a little heat. Is I just had

Ian  
a little malfunction in my truck. I was telling you guys before. Or the belt on the compressor, I didn't, must have been going out, and I didn't know. And the process of doing a little little maneuver in traffic that happened to me, I heard a little weird noise, and lo and behold, I've got no AC right now. And my dad, my dad's got a bunch of tools and parts and stuff. So I called him up, and I was like, Hey Dad, what can we what can we work out, how much do I owe you? What do we what do we do? What do we need to do? And he's like, I gotta. I'm really busy with work this week, and so I'm not going to be available till Friday, and this happened on Sunday. So I was like, okay, you know I'm, I'm gonna be patient and wait for it. So he and I are gonna meet up tomorrow as the time of this, as the time of us recording. But it definitely has not been fun driving.

Stoney   
You've been using the AC. Just been using the other AC. You've been using four by 55

Ian  
I've been sticking my head out the window, rolling four

Stoney   
windows down, and going 55 miles an hour, and hanging your head out.

Jason  
The first car I had was, it was a little truck, a little Ford courier.

Ian  
Okay, it

Jason  
was powder blue. Had no AC. So I do quite remember those, oh yeah, those days of driving to school and my dad and the windows down.

Jason  
My dad had

Ian  
an old GM, like a maroon GMC truck, like 90s model or something. I'm not even sure what the what model it was, but it was, he had an extra truck that ran and stuck around. And so if I wasn't driving my mom's car, whenever she needed it, I was driving that old, that old reliable truck. And sure enough, it didn't have AC in it, but it got me places. It got me to my first job a handful of times. So, you know, got to do what you got to do. But I definitely, in this day and age though, I definitely have been spoiled a little bit. So now that it's not here, I'm like, Oh man, I took it for granted until, yeah, especially in these hotter months.

Jason  
Oh yeah, gets there. I mean, it said, May, you know, this is what we're April 30. So yeah, tomorrow.

Ian  
That's crazy.

Jason  
I can't I it's hard. It's like, I just remember January, yeah,

Ian  
I feel like you got married yesterday.

Stoney   
I will

Stoney   
tell you this Forrest Gump had it wrong. Life is not like a box of chocolates, more like a roll of toilet paper. The closer the end you get, the faster it goes.

Ian  
Okay,

Stoney   
so you're getting toward the end, and so that rolls going faster,

Jason  
oh yes, you'll look

Stoney   
up and go, Oh, wow, that was another five.

Jason  
What? That's a terrible feeling.

Stoney   
100%

Jason  
Yeah,

Ian  
yeah. So what we got on the on the dock today, guys,

Jason  
well, I this, this whole, I mean, I think this topic came up when we were discussing last week. I think George, well, came up and, and I think I brought up some, some, some statistics regarding some with Ring, ring doorbells, yes.

Stoney   
Well, I had mentioned before the dynamic pricing thing, right?

Jason  
So

Stoney   
and so it's kind of melded in together of the the surveillance state, yeah,

Jason  
for the lack of a better term, that's kind of what we've nicknamed it. Is this, it is this embracing of video recording and just monitoring and stuff like that. For it's just becoming more and more common, and I think it has kind of snuck up on as a matter of fact, it's so funny. Just recently, I believe this week, the US House voted again to renew the surveillance law under Section 702, of US Code, which basically allows intelligence agencies to collect communications that can include Americans,

Ian  
wow,

Jason  
so without a warrant?

Ian  
Yes,

Jason  
I may add. So you know, there is, I mean, really, I would, most people would tell you that this really started with the Patriot Act after 911 and generally, what happens is people get afraid, and that's when freedom start.

Stoney   
You start giving them only the sleeping people think that it started at 911 Okay, everybody who's awoke and knows what's going on knows it's been going on for a lot longer than that, and that's just when they're putting in laws, because they're trading, and you kind of said it, you know, comfort, or, you know, freedom. And basically you're trading, you know, safety for freedom, right? And our leaders, which they aren't our leaders, and I'm not going to get on that one anymore. They want this, but then they want it to serve them, like in Louisiana, them passing laws that says, oh, you can't record now unless both people know you're recording. Why is that? because they don't want you to be able to record them doing their shaky shit, but they should be able to record us just because they can. Okay. Constitution says you cannot set yourself apart from the citizens. We have a governor that was an attorney general that thought he was going to be the Attorney General of this country, but that didn't work out for him twice. Who's now signing a law, an unconstitutional law, that says you can't record somebody Oh, but the government can.

Jason  
I'll be very curious if someone challenges that law.

Stoney   
Well, Louisiana is one of only a couple of states that is a one person, one party. Yeah, one party. And it needs to stay that way. The whole country should be that way. The only people that don't want that are the ones trying to hide something and don't want something. You know, if you don't say it, you don't have to worry about it being recorded, right? If you don't do it, you don't have to worry about it being

Jason  
recorded. But there's

Stoney   
a reason that they want to be able to record you and you not record them. That's the first thing.

Jason  
Yeah, I was looking at some, just some general stats on just this whole bit of, you know, everybody's recording each other and and all this other stuff now, and it's just, these are some of the numbers. I guys, it's 78% of Americans say surveillance has increased over the past 25 years, which I would agree wholeheartedly. I mean, ever since 911 I mean that we've just kind of been on this. We've been kind of on this. Yeah, on this bowl, this role of doing this kind of stuff,

Stoney   
speaking of surveillance,

Jason  
well, that's actually, yeah, that's actually a

Stoney   
ring camera.

Jason  
My, my, my wife just made it home, so that lets me know that she's, she's there. 56% call mass data collection an unnecessary intrusion.

Stoney   
What do y'all think the data centers are for? What do y'all think the data centers are far okay? They're gonna have so much information that they have to store and process that they want to survey you. And guess what? They want you to pay for it? Of course.

Jason  
Well, of course. I mean, that's all.

Stoney   
I mean, what? Where you think all this information is going to

Jason  
go? I mentioned last week just for the ring doorbell cameras and the how many people now? I mean, the government didn't even have to even do anything. People are have already built the network themselves. I mean, we've done it. And in our, in our way of protecting ourselves, we've, we've done the work for them.

Stoney   
Well, I mean, think about, okay, Facebook was not invented by Mark Zuckerberg. Facebook was invented by the CIA, who gave it to Mark Zuckerberg to run with, right? What was one of the things they kept doing. Hey, post a picture of you when you were five, and now post one of you today. All that was, was face recognition, going to the government. Oh, look, what's your favorite color? Hey, what? What street were you born on? Oh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. What do y'all think that was? That was information, how to bust your passwords, how to do all of this stuff from the government and hackers.

Jason  
Yeah, that. I think a lot of people are unaware of the origins of Facebook. And yes, it did we

Stoney   
want to bitch and moan about being surveyed, but then here we'll just openly, well,

Ian  
because they, because they make it easy to say yes and difficult to opt out of

Stoney   
it. Yeah, absolutely. That's,

Ian  
that's the whole thing is, like, again, it's the same thing with like cookies on your computer. Nowadays, they have a lot of things in place where, where websites have to tell you about, like, yes, I want to allow cookies on the website. I want to allow like data to be stored on my computer. So that way it's like, quote, unquote, easier to access the website later. But a lot of that stuff is also, like, data tracking stuff. And again, it makes it super simple to be just, like, just allow just, just allow it. Just do it, because it makes it easier. But like, for me, who doesn't want that kind of stuff, I have to go in there and specifically say, like, no, no, just do the necessary stuff. I don't want, I don't want you to store a bunch of, like, algorithmic stuff that, like the tracking stuff on my shopping stuff, like, I don't, I know, I don't want you to put all that stuff on there. So I have to go in there. And for every website I go on to, it's a big prompt. I have to go in there and go, no, no, no, no. Just, just accept the necessary things only. And that's a big thing now, is, like, I now have, have been severely inconvenienced in this whole modern world, because that same

Stoney   
recipe is kind of like arguing with a woman the terms of service. Instead of doing it, you're just going to go to the end and hit, I agree, and nobody's going to read the whole thing.

Ian  
Okay,

Stoney   
you know, we're not going to go through it, because what do they put on it? Because most people, Jason said it, convenience, right? Agree? Yeah. What? Are they really putting on there? What are they really taking what are they really, you know, looking at it's

Ian  
the same thing again. Now we live in a world where like, shopping online is the norm and shopping in a normal store is not. So the whole thing is like, obviously we weren't. We live in a place now where, like, the internet sees where you're shopping, and we'll try and find you things. And people like that. People like the fact that the internet now can like, recommend them things that they want to see. Like, I like that thing. But the problem is, there's also a lot of other data that gets tracked in that same thing that like again, and this, the whole thing is that, yes, I like this feature. I don't personally, I'm just saying like, people do that. They say that. But there's also a lot of other baggage that's involved in that. And again, it's super easy. Just go like, yeah, just accept it. Let it be a Japanese

Stoney   
when you're walking through them all, you're walking by store. Hey, they put on your phone. Hey, you have a 15% off coupon. You have a 5% if you come in right now and buy something, will give you this

Jason  
which

Stoney   
now works in toward the dynamic pricing thing. When Walmart just announced that they are changing and getting away from their paper tags and going to a digital display, and

Jason  
it's all going to be

Stoney   
what it is is it's watching you, and it can change that price depending on the clothes you wear, depending on phone you own, what kind of car it saw you drive up in, right? This is called dynamic pricing. This is, this is a real thing. And even even this week, North Carolina passed a law that says they are not banning the CCT V cameras, the security cameras, but they are banning this. They are banning the algorithmic video use of people for dynamic pricing. Yeah. So North Carolina is seeing it coming

Ian  
well, but I think also there I hear that, but I think there is, like, some, some of that is not totally true. I think,

Stoney   
no, that's actually,

Ian  
I know some of it. I believe it is dynamic pricing for certain areas, in in towns. I don't think it's for, like, individuals. It's for Okay, okay. I don't believe, I don't believe that that's okay. I'm just saying, I think that those tags, they're getting away from paper tags, because, again, it's all in this effort to be more green. They want an electric tag. They can just like that. Someone can go and like, they have it at Best Buy, and they've had

Stoney   
it for the tag. It's just a tool. The point dynamic pricing is it's changing it for who you are, right?

Ian  
And what I'm saying is that the

Stoney   
tag is irrelevant, I know, but what

Ian  
I'm saying is, like, from the company's perspective, the company's like, we want to stop having to buy paper tags and paying a human being to go change out all the paper tags. We'd rather just have something that we can just, like, click a button and it's going to change someone with an iPad,

Stoney   
convenience, freedom for safety.

Ian  
Well, I'm saying, what I'm saying is like, I think that there's the part that gets confusing with a lot of stuff we talk about. Sometimes it's like, there is truth, and then sometimes I feel like there's this, like it gets stretched a little too far. I Maybe you're right. Maybe there's something I didn't read about, as far as, like they're watching people, but I don't think the prices are going to change on a dime because someone that walked in with a suit walked in and it's going to change. That's what's happening. Okay? And maybe I need to read, maybe I need to read something about that, because I haven't

Jason  
read that, I don't believe, I think the computer now is doing what, in essence, what, how sales people have always responded to the public that have attended their stores, right? And that's why someone walks in dressed as somewhat kind of mediocre or whatever. Its studies have shown those people are approached differently than maybe somebody walking in with designer clothes, a suit or something like that, because that person is perceived to probably have more money,

Ian  
yes,

Jason  
and to have

Ian  
status. And what I'm saying, what I'm saying is, like, as a, as a, as a multinational company, I can look at a place like California and say, Okay, we got a lot of high income people here that that they get, that have that demand higher pay. So let's go ahead and just hike up all the prices there, digitally, overnight, if you wanted to whereas, like, somewhere over here that's like, more and like the slums, we can just, like, knock them down a little bit, or raise them ever so slightly in certain areas. And have it be, because I've worked at places where the thermostat of the facility was controlled by someone at a corporate location a few states over, yep. So I'd be like, Man, it is hot as hell in here. Yep. Because, again, they're, like, they don't live in Louisiana, where it's it's 80 degrees right now, and so it's set to, like, 74 which is probably fine for them, but for us, it's hot in here. And so that kind of stuff. I'm

Stoney   
talking about is North Carolina Senate Bill 839, called the price Transparency Act, which was introduced April 20. Eighth, 2026, and it would ban algorithmic pricing,

Ian  
right?

Stoney   
Which is exactly

Ian  
algorithmic pricing,

Stoney   
watching you

Ian  
watching a area as I'm saying,

Stoney   
no, okay, there's

Ian  
well, then let me bring

Stoney   
it down to the individual.

Ian  
Let me read, let me read something about that. Let me get some data on that, where it's the individual, and again, it changes the second I walk in the store that as I have hard to believe that? Well, I will. If I'm standing here and I see a price, this is $5 all of a sudden, a very, very high fluting person stands up. All of a sudden, the price changes just next in the few seconds i That's where I get a little bit more confused about how that's You see, I'm saying

Jason  
right at the same time I'm seeing something here. When I was doing the initial research for this topic, I see there's been some some states are starting to try to push back on some of this surveillance stuff. But I see Maryland became just the first state,

Stoney   
first state to do

Jason  
to ban surveillance pricing.

Stoney   
Yes,

Jason  
this is where companies use your data to decide how much you personally should pay for groceries.

Ian  
Okay,

Jason  
so there's something there, right? Also just, kind of just, you know, following on with my that's my stat stuff here said 71% fear it could be used to target political enemies, which that's, I think, being that's happening now. But this is a disturbing fact, and this is what I've always talked about. 42% say, this is the corner survey. 42% say they would trade privacy for security. And this is, this goes back to this very thing. I've always said that when things get really tight and you are afraid, you are willing to do things that you never thought you would ever entertain a truly, truly believe that. And I think the statistics show are true on that. Just, I mean, just look at covet was a perfect example. That was the first time that we ever as a society, felt we had lost control and we were afraid, and we were willing to do things that I would think a year before, those same people said I would never do that. And I'm just, I'm just telling you that I think fear is a huge thing, and if you can promise safety with additional cameras and stuff like that, security gates and all these things, people are willing to put out money.

Stoney   
But what's the saying? Who's watching? The Watchers?

Jason  
Well, okay,

Stoney   
there's the problem.

Jason  
I would agree. I mean, that's always easy

Stoney   
to put it in. Now it's like all the cars. They passed a law now that all cars in 2028 now have to have this stuff in it to where if it deems you unfit.

Jason  
Oh yeah,

Stoney   
the car is not going to turn on again with Oxford. Oxford now has said we will be the first 15 minute city in the world, and they're going to have all of this stuff where your speeds checked.

Jason  
Yep, I saw that

Stoney   
in and out.

Jason  
Every

Stoney   
car

Stoney   
checked, every car, every

Jason  
mandated.

Stoney   
Yes, everything will be mandated in Oxford now, and here it is, okay? So yeah, right now, maybe it's just this cute little digital thing. What's it going to be five years from now? What's it going to be when these things start changing? That's where we have to look to the future.

Jason  
I believe I forwarded y'all an article on this new thing that's coming on cars that actually may be an interesting topic.

Stoney   
Your wife is pregnant, and all of a sudden, oh, my God, oh, we got to get to the doctor. And, sir, I believe you're too agitated to drive

Jason  
the car down.

Stoney   
Your eyes are dilated, and, you know,

Jason  
oh yeah, I that there's there. It

Stoney   
won't even turn the car

Jason  
off. It can happen. Yeah, they say 92% of Americans say they're concerned about their online privacy, and then 72% want stronger regulation on how companies use their data. Meanwhile, only 2% fully trust AI systems to make fair decisions.

Ian  
I don't like the fact right now that, like, all of AI is has come down to the decisions of like, three to five people,

Jason  
because

Ian  
that's what there's a lot of stuff right now that's being determined as far as like, like reality, that kind of stuff. And that's the part, that's the part of AI that I'm not a big fan of right now. That's making me kind of is the fact that it's all based on their opinions and what they want it to be, which is not,

Stoney   
well, I think with Maryland and North Carolina coming out, they're telling us that they believe this stuff is no longer theoretical, that this is real life and it's coming. And some of the people who know. What's coming or saying we need to stop this, or try to stop it before it gets too far.

Ian  
I just read, I didn't realize that surveillance pricing was like a lot of online stuff. I thought that we were talking about things that were happening in

Stoney   
it's all

Ian  
in reality, right, right, right, but a lot of people are

Stoney   
facial recognition.

Ian  
Well, well, no, no. The stuff I'm reading here is about data use, such as, like, location, browsing history and your shopping habits to set individual pricing for goods and services by analyzing your behavior and, like, all that kind of stuff. So yes, I think there's some of their some of the stuff is in reality, like ride share services. Apparently, there's a big thing that was dealing with Lyft and Uber for this situation where like you could pay more if you were if the algorithm deemed you worthy and or like willing enough to pay more, I guess so. Anyways, I didn't realize. I haven't read up on surveillance pricing, but that's interesting. That's what

Stoney   
I'm saying. It's taking this

Ian  
taking this right

Stoney   
sees you walk in and says this person can pay more. That's the point. It's taken all of your right. And

Ian  
what I was trying to say was, I've never heard of it in, like, a brick and mortar location. I'm really realizing now that I don't think that it's gonna I don't think we're talking about brick and mortar locations

Stoney   
and we are talking about brick

Jason  
Okay,

Ian  
and that's where I start to I start to disagree. I think maybe in the future, but, like, right now, maybe I don't know if Walmart would do something like that, but I think they would online. If you go to buy your groceries online and you potentially they deem you willing enough to pay more, you may pay more, but I don't think the price of the stuff inside is going to change just because I walked in there with a little extra money or something. But maybe I'm wrong.

Jason  
They say adults under 45 are less likely than older Americans to say the amount of government surveillance has increased since 2,067% versus 87% so to me, now we're getting to a generational view of this, and I think what that's telling me is younger people are more used to tech and cameras and all the things, and so they've become conditioned to it, and it doesn't bother them as much as, say, people who grew up without it.

Ian  
I think also, I think it may also be hard to notice that when everyone is filming everything, it's hard to it's hard to see that the government is watching you more, because it feels like everyone's watching you more, you know, I mean, everyone has a camera,

Jason  
everything, everybody is recording, everybody.

Ian  
So once everything becomes, you know, a record, then it's like, well, is anything? Maybe that's a hypothetical. But, you know, whereas once upon a time, the older generation, that was not really a thing, and now all of a sudden, you know, every there's a camera everywhere. Is what it feels

Jason  
like. And as homes, you know, as homes become more smart. I mean, everything,

Ian  
yeah.

Stoney   
Well, how many times has it been proven in the last year that the smart meters are overcharging people over charging people? Because electricians have gone in and put their own tight meter in ahead or behind. I guess I don't know how they do it. Of the electric, you know, smart meter and the numbers aren't adding up.

Jason  
Yeah, just, I'm telling you, and what people need to be paying attention to is this digital digital currency,

Ian  
I'm telling you, I think that's been kind of quietly put in there, and I think they're just gonna eventually turn the switch on, and eventually, now all your money's gonna be tracked. Mean, think about nobody really uses cash anymore. So everybody uses credit card. I mean, hell, I do all the time. So, I mean, for all intents and purposes, I use digital payment. I don't I feel like in the in in the there used to be once upon a time where I'd go to concerts or go to events and things like that, and they wouldn't have the ability to take a card. So it was only, it was cash only for everything. But I've noticed over the course of like, the past year or two, that I've gone to a few places they're refusing cash. Yeah, yeah, they don't have cash. Yeah,

Jason  
it's, it's, it's, like, it's an additional thing they got to keep up with,

Ian  
of course. And also it's risk, yes, especially

Jason  
rob the store. Now, if you don't have no cash in there, okay, Rob. What you gonna rob? I mean, you know, other than maybe individuals that might have cash,

Ian  
you can still the iPad, that is, but it's not gonna get you anywhere,

Jason  
yeah, exactly,

Ian  
yeah,

Jason  
yeah. I'm just Just FYI, just to let our listeners know what's going on with this, this house approving this, renewing this warrantless domestic surveillance program. It cleared the House on Wednesday after house. Speaker Mike Johnson and Trump administration officials persuaded Republican Republican holdouts to back the bill, the renewal of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act now goes to the Senate, where potentially a rough reception because it was attached to unrelated legislation that would restrict the Federal Reserve's ability to issue digital currency, something Senate Majority Leader John Thune has described as a non starter. So interesting, interesting how this is playing out, that digital currencies, it's right down underneath the surface, and it little by little. Let's put it in there. They

Stoney   
can't control cash. They can control your digital currency, and they can shut it down if they don't, if your carbon footprint isn't right, or if you say something on social media, or they don't want you to buy a gun, or they don't want you to do this, or they don't want you to do that, they shut it down.

Jason  
Yeah, that that whole deal is called FISA. I'm sure y'all have heard of that just listening to the news, but it has drawn a lot of bipartisan skepticism, because section 702, allows authorities to bypass warrant requirements before rifling through vast halls of Americans communication data. There you go,

Stoney   
I mean, when you're looking at this whole thing, when you've got aI coming out, you've got the data centers, you've got all of this surveillance there, you know, Ian used to say, We need somebody watch dog in the AI stuff. And there needs to be rules in here. We need rules just for basic life now, and we had that under the Constitution, but it's been so watered down and so muddied up. You know? Why? Why can't we just have no secret pricing based on personal vulnerability? How about no selling of driver monitoring data to insurers without clear consent? About no government access to vehicles to data, vehicle data without due process, okay, no political punishment disguised as Safety Enforcement. How about no carbon score, mobility restrictions without an open democratic debate and no black box algorithms making life decisions that citizens cannot question. How about we just make it simple,

Ian  
but then that starts taking away power and money from people. That's how the world works.

Jason  
Yeah, I was reading about very curious.

Stoney   
I mean, this is not anti technology. This is pro citizen, right here. Well,

Jason  
I think, I hate to say it, but I think the natural evolutionary process of our society, I think it's almost impossible for it not to become a surveillance state. I truly do. We're already there. Well, I mean, for all intensive purposes, they got satellites all in the sky. They can pinpoint the satellite on your house down to the driveway.

Stoney   
They can count the hairs on your head,

Jason  
right? Exactly.

Ian  
Thing is, is that that also gives you the ability to have Google Maps anywhere in the world that you want, yes, which is a convenience I like, right? So, like, there again, there's like, a give and take where it's like, yes, there are some of this that I hate, but there's also, like, I have been in the middle of nowhere where I have no idea where I am, and with enough cell service and enough battery charge, I can get home and like, that's the thing that like are

Stoney   
you could have just looked through them. Well, yeah, I know. We did

Ian  
it. I know. And again, what I'm saying I live in a world now where I don't have to do that, and I like that. That's what I'm saying. Is like, there are, there are,

Stoney   
here comes a generational thing you were talking about.

Jason  
But,

Ian  
yeah, the thing is, we're saying all that, but we're have. We have people that have opted in to having ring cameras in their home, one of which sits at the table here, one of which we talked about last week. Yeah, who has now? Video, Ed, no, mine. He has one of his home. He has, he has, he has purchased one and has it at his thing. And that is

Stoney   
that ring. I just don't

Jason  
I look at my house all the time, all during the day. Sorry,

Ian  
I didn't realize. I'm sorry I forgot that I wasn't trying to out him. Or just,

Stoney   
no, okay,

Ian  
then there's two at this table. Sorry, I forgot. I don't have it. I thought that. I thought Stoney didn't have

Stoney   
it either, but I forgot on silent.

Ian  
All I'm saying is, is that we that is a level of surveillance that, again, you have purchased and you have allowed into, like, at least the front door of your house, that you that you opted into that. You chose to have that, again, is probably being tracked by Amazon or whomever, and there's probably data being picked up from it, or, I don't know, and at that point, but, but again, same thing like we talked about last week with this, this circumstance took place. You now have evidence to go to, like law enforcement, and there's like, a level of that that's like my house of. Probably been tracked or again, it's probably the data that's being collected from it is probably being part of this greater web of ring doorbells that is being mapped out throughout whatever else you want to say. But at a certain point, there's a convenience you get of like, I cannot be home, and my wife and child could be home, and I now know who's going to be coming up to my door and or whatever, you know, and that kind of stuff where it's like, I like the ability. People may not like it. I haven't I have a lock, and if I need to, and I'm not home and the door is unlocked, I can lock it from wherever I am,

Stoney   
yeah, but I also can unlock

Ian  
nobody.

Stoney   
Okay, you believe that.

Ian  
I believe that wholeheartedly. Okay, good

Stoney   
luck with that.

Ian  
Okay, okay. And I have had that thing for six years, and I've never had anybody been able to get into my house except for me. And maybe one day the police can somehow hack into it and get into it, maybe Google, from on high will unlock it and without me being aware of it. But that's never happened to me, and I have I purchased it, and I've gotten my money's worth out of it, and I and I love that convenience of I can be out of this state, and if I ever needed to, I can lock my house.

Jason  
As I said that I think it's because your generation is so accustomed to being watched being, in essence, a little bit more controlled than older generation. I mean, you know, we remember a time when you just didn't have that level of

Ian  
right

Jason  
government involvement in your life.

Ian  
Yes,

Jason  
the way it is today, and

Stoney   
even just government involvement. Mark Zuckerberg, Bill Gates,

Jason  
right? Well, there was really no there was no internet, there's no tech. There's, I mean, you know, credit cards were done with that machine, with the with the carbon,

Stoney   
we actually had to use our brains and remember where we were, or be able to read a map

Ian  
and watch it. Buddy watch it.

Stoney   
So, no, I'm not watching it, because that's the point. People are stupid today, because all they rely on is electronics. But we at least could get point A to point B without a

Ian  
phone. Same I can get I can get anywhere in this city. You can tell me where to go, and I'll get you there in 30 to 45 minutes. Can guarantee it. But what I'm saying is, is that if I there, if there was ever an emergency, and there has been where I have been, somewhere, where I've never been before, right, I can safely get back home. And that is a convenience that I love, right? Whereas before maybe, and you'd be out of luck or have to, or

Stoney   
have to, we could figure it out on our owns, because we used to do that,

Ian  
okay,

Stoney   
we have a quarter or dime or we could call somebody, right or something.

Ian  
And again, in this day and age, there is no quarter or dime phones. I'm not going to go hitchhike somewhere. I'm not going to go talk to go talk to some sort of random person to try and get their phone from them, or to ask, I could ask for directions and that. Again, yes, there has been moments where I probably have done things not having my phone. I'm just saying there are some conveniences that like I don't like, the greater outcome probably from being surveilled. But at the same time, there are conveniences in my life

Jason  
that are built into

Ian  
that I do

Stoney   
like he's saying you're willing to trade some of it, freedom,

Ian  
yes,

Stoney   
for convenience, right? You're one of those people. Okay, okay, right? And I have to be, I am, but you're the one, because you're using the problem.

Ian  
Because I feel like you are attacking me.

Stoney   
I am. I am attacking you. I'm attacking everyone like you that's willing to give up your God given freedoms to this Constitution for a little convenience. I

Ian  
hope you delete your ways Absolutely. Hope you delete your ways app. I hope you delete your Google Earth app or Google Maps whatever. And I hope that you just can figure it out. Then figure it out. Okay, do it.

Stoney   
I've done it before.

Ian  
Then do it right now,

Ian  
if

Jason  
you're gonna go

Ian  
back to a paper map, then do

Jason  
it.

Stoney   
We, can, we, you

Ian  
can, I can? We

Stoney   
could shut down a whole generation by writing in cursive stick shift and having to use math.

Ian  
First of all, I did all that.

Stoney   
You're one.

Ian  
Okay, okay, then quit attacking me. I don't believe that I'm a perfect representation of the millennial generation. There are a lot of people in my in my age bracket that I feel like are more dependent on technology and on social media, and that is not me. And all I'm saying is that there are some things that I have enjoyed. As far as this is concerned, I work at a place now that has cameras throughout the entire perimeter and has keypad locks, and I tell you what, the second we got all that stuff put in place, that place felt so much safer. We had keys, and we had so many people that had keys to the building, so many so that we didn't know who all had keys to the building. And at that point it's like, who can get in here? Who knows? Well, at that point it's also like, it was a darkly lit parking lot.

Jason  
I think that's true, and that's, I think that's a good thing if I perceive if I'm safer. The thing about perception is not necessarily it's ground in reality. It is a perception that I'm safe, just like if I perceive a place to be bad, even though the day. Data behind it doesn't make it bad, but if I perceive it to be bad, it's bad. That's just the way the human brain thinks. I think, though that's what go back to what I said. I think the natural evolution of society, as we become more and more tech heavy, more cameras, more AI and facial recognition. You know, electronic, this electronic that I think is, is good in some respect, just like I said in my intro, you know, we can solve crimes better now we think of the advantage of DNA,

Ian  
yeah,

Jason  
and those advantage of how that's helped law enforcement fixing I remember when what they call them crash data retrieval systems. I remember in my previous previous life, when those that technology came out with came to cars, and the stuff you can download off a car, I remember the civil libertarian saying, oh, you know, they're going crazy over you know, what are you capturing, whether I'm wearing my seat belt

Ian  
and right,

Jason  
how fast I'm driving? And, you know, those are the same people that fight all the time, even though that may come in handy to determine was this person driving 80 miles an hour down the road in a 45 mile an hour speed zone and cause a fatality.

Ian  
Yeah.

Jason  
I mean, but you got the purists out there like, well, they have no right to that,

Ian  
right?

Jason  
You know, you can kind of play that game back and forth. I mean, as I say, there's good parts, there's bad parts, and ultimately, it's up to the wisdom of of the people that are using it to do it, use it for the right reasons, right?

Stoney   
Well, those people don't exist. So that doesn't exist.

Ian  
It got to a point. It got to a point with my Amazon where I didn't like the fact that there was like, I felt like it was

Jason  
Alexa,

Ian  
well, and then just Amazon, my account in general, they got to a point where I don't like shopping on Amazon. I didn't like the stuff that was being recommended to me. I didn't like the fact that it felt like it was I didn't I just didn't like it. I didn't like it was making me uncomfortable. I started reading more into all this stuff about it. I just got rid of my whole account. I deleted all of it. Was like, it's okay. And and I and people are so wrapped up in their Amazon account. They love it. And there are people in my generation to that, like that. I feel like they, they live off of that. My mother, for instance, love that, loves that. And I'm like, I just don't and that. And again, I'm not saying that I have, like, fixed everything with that, but at a certain point it's like, I don't know. You gotta I

Jason  
you know you know, something Stoney mentioned here, just regarding just kind of piggybacking more on this surveillance pricing. I kind of pulled up an article here talking about Maryland, which I find very interesting. They say, when engaging in surveillance pricing, stores rapidly change the cost of products based on consumer data, including their location, internet search history and demographics. That means buyers are paying different prices for the same items purchased around the same time. They say. While Maryland's new law focuses on grocery stores, a Federal Trade Commission has documented examples of surveillance pricing stores selling clothing, beauty products, Home Goods and hardware. Said consumer groups note that there's an added urgency when it comes to grocery stores, though, given that they affect Americans ability to access affordable foods, I'm very curious what would make price for food more expensive for one person than what

Stoney   
you wear, the car you drive, what you're buying online, what you're doing, what you're searching that's the whole point. That's what dynamic pricing is. You can afford more. We're going to pay you're gonna pay more?

Jason  
Yeah, well, it's this is a big deal here.

Stoney   
Maryland saw it in their stores, in the brick and mortars. North Carolina is following suit. States are waking up to this. They're seeing the abuses that are happening, and that can even happen in greater ways in the future, because you got to think about it, they're just experimenting with the stuff now.

Jason  
Yeah, what's

Stoney   
going to happen 10 years from now, when all of these data centers are in play and all of this information's out there? I

Jason  
personally think they put this stuff out there and they let it kind of marinate.

Ian  
Oh, yeah,

Jason  
how people react to it? And let it sit, and they let it sit because right now they say bills are being considered in Colorado, California, Massachusetts, Illinois and New Jersey that may likewise regulate surveillance pricing. But I'm telling you, this is what happens. The tech gets out there. It gets into the consciousness of people. And then people get used to it, and they just kind of go with the flow, because, well, everybody's doing it's all over the place, so

Stoney   
Terms of Service just hit agree. Terms of Service just hit agree,

Jason  
yeah, 

Stoney   
that's what people are doing. You like Ian said, cookies. Okay, I'll just give you the cookies.

Jason  
I just, I just think that the digital currency, that's when, that's when you're going to see it. I think if that ever drops, and I think it's coming, I think that's when, all of a sudden, we're going to wake up and go, we're in a completely different world.

Stoney   
Oh, we're not going to be able to do anything like they have to do that if you know you won't be able to because you won't. They're not going to take cash.

Jason  
No,

Stoney   
okay, so if

Jason  
you can buy, what they tell you, you can buy.

Stoney   
Okay, so if they don't want you to, then you can't do something in in China, you jaywalk. What do they do? They plaster your face on billboards all across your city. They automatically fine you for it. This is already happening. This isn't a joke. This isn't somebody pretending or thinking it's going to happen. They're doing it because it's all digital your town. It's, you know, it may not be like a 15 minute city there, but they're going to your social score isn't right? That's what China is based off of a social score. You say something wrong, you do something wrong.

Jason  
Well, they

Stoney   
take it away from you.

Jason  
They are critics right now with Maryland's new law, because they said it doesn't really necessarily protect individual rights. They say a point in particular to a provision that only allows the State's Attorney General and not individuals to enforce the law. So as an individual, you can't, like file suit, it's going to require a gut the government to actually do it on your behalf. So it comes with some some catches there. So just FYI, 

Stoney   
if somebody creates murder, does a murder. You can't take it on yourself. You have to go through the system to get this the same thing. If somebody wrongs you, you got to go, oh, hopefully the government's going to take care of me. Yeah, hold your breath.

Jason  
Well, they say right now, said, and here, just kind of breaking it down by political parties. Says, you know, 84% of Americans include 92% of Republicans and 80% of Democrats say it's accessible it's acceptable for the US government to monitor the online activity of suspected terrorists. So around two thirds of Americans thinks it's acceptable for the government to monitor online activity of each of the following groups, citizens and countries that are hostile to the US politicians and illegal immigrants. So say. Majorities of Republicans say it's acceptable for the US government to monitor online activity of international students, politician government workers, political activists, citizens of countries that are us, allies and journalists

Stoney   
see here's here's what. I don't care if you're a US citizen, they shouldn't be able to do anything to you. I don't care who you are. If you're not a US citizen, the US government should be able to monitor you as they see fit, even if you're in this country. But if you're a US citizen, they have to go through due process for that. That's what the Constitution guarantees. If you're not a US citizen, please, by all means, watch do whatever you want to a non US citizen. I don't care.

Jason  
I think the initial intent, or the original intent of the US Constitution, and the way our founders were probably thinking of freedom, they would probably be quite horrified about, what about how much power the federal government holds over people nowadays, and it's, it's, it's a shame, because I do think the federal government has forgotten what the 10th Amendment is, but we are now fully entrenched in a in a national, national approach to things. And we are, I think we are heading toward a 1984 I think it's it's going that way. I think it's inevitable. I hate to say that. I hate to sound negative and dystopian, or whatever you want to call it just, I just, I just think that there's always going to be crime. I mean, we just here locally, we had a tragedy that happened. Was it last week? You know, what are the first calls,

Stoney   
multiple tragedies

Jason  
over the last what are the calls? More cameras, you know, more more police, more this, more that it's constant. You know, fear that, oh, it's going to happen again, and it's going to happen while I'm I'm there, or whatever the case may be. So I said it is kind of goes back to, I just think when people are fearful, people do things they would not think they would do. I just do. That's why

Stoney   
the government and the ultra elite use fear to get what they want.

Jason  
The media plays. That's that's their big time.

Jason  
I always like the hypothetical. You know, if you start getting targeted for certain beliefs, you may help regardless, it may be religious or whatever the case may be. I think right now, what happened during the previous administration, under President Biden, when they were targeting traditional Catholic groups for their stance on abortion.

Ian  
Yeah,

Jason  
and they were being investigated.

Stoney   
They were classified as terrorists.

Jason  
That's what I'm saying. So,

Stoney   
I mean, that's

Jason  
what I'm saying. This is where this is, this is where it this is where it can go very quickly, and it doesn't take much to go there until they start investigating you for something that you don't like. I mean, I hate to say this, but, I mean, there's, there's certain platforms I've been banned because of some comment that somebody perceived to be,

Ian  
yeah,

Jason  
cruel, or, you know, whatever the case may be, and then I get, you get suspended because you're not respecting people, and it's like you can't even have a conversation. But this is, this is part of this, right stuff we're talking about here. I mean, it's your

Stoney   
social score.

Jason  
As long as you

Stoney   
remember social

Stoney   
school,

Stoney   
your next comment you make, you're not gonna You can't have access to your bank for 30 days

Jason  
exactly. I can see that happening. I really can't. You get the right people in power.

Jason  
You

Stoney   
drive too far this month. Next month, we're gonna cut your car time down in half. You're gonna make that far. I

Ian  
hear you. I don't, I don't think it'll get to you.

Jason  
Don't think so. I

Ian  
don't think so.

Jason  
I think I would,

Ian  
I think, I think, I think what, I think, what you're talking about is, like, personal communities, like, if you were in like, a small group, or whatever, a little echo chamber, and you're talking, you know, opposite to what they're talking about, they had the right to ban you, that I definitely would believe in the fact that, like, there's going to be, I think, little tight knit groups or that kind of stuff. But, I mean, maybe you're right, and like the government doing something like

Jason  
that, but I think it's already proved it that I think the groundwork was laid, from what I saw during that time, of them targeting certain groups that were deemed unacceptable, right to the political narrative of the time, right? So that's what I'm saying. But I still

Ian  
think that they have

Stoney   
Christian nationalist

Jason  
Yep. I think that's the next thing that if ever the other side gets into power, I would not surprise if those groups are targeted, either through the IRS or some other thing, because it was happening under under the Biden administration, these little, small conservative Christian groups also in getting notices to get audited by the IRS, and meanwhile, Black Lives Matter and all these other groups, nothing's happening to them. I mean, so it just, I think it's been proven that I think it could happen. It's shown it could happen. All it takes is for the right people without a very good moral compass to better utilize these systems in ways that could hurt people.

Ian  
Right?

Jason  
So I would think, do do? I hope it doesn't. I hope not really do, but humankind be when humankind is, and especially today's world, where everybody is offended by everything you know, and you can't have conversations because I perceive you're attacking me or whatever the case. Institution

Stoney   
doesn't guarantee that you're not going to be offended. Shut up. That's not what the Constitution guarantees.

Jason  
It's just

Stoney   
for the record. The best predictor of the future was the movie demolition. Man,

Jason  
yeah, I remember that movie

Stoney   
that was the best predictor of the future. It is the closest sci fi movie to what's happening to us at this point right now, period, what you say, how you say it, fine, fine, fine. You know, while you're walking there and you say a cuss word and you get a fine, really,

Ian  
I hear you, but like, that's not the reality we live in right now.

Stoney   
That's the reality that's coming. It may not be exactly today. I think there's been cities and stores that have tried it, and they're testing it, but that's what's coming. And if we're not ready for it, what Jason's saying is, very quickly, overnight, basically it could change.

Ian  
I write and I hear what you're saying, but I think that second to the you. Uh, the only thing next to the freedom to bear arms is the freedom of speech. I feel like, and I and I, yes, there has been things I think, that have pressed against that, but I feel like, if you start finding people for the things they say that, I feel like the the larger American public would would fight back against that. But maybe I'm wrong, but maybe I'm too optimistic, but I feel like that's something that I feel like, once you start taking the freedom to say what you want to say, you know, online is a different thing, saying things out loud and, you know, you know, somehow taking financial privileges away from people, or whatever, I feel like that's a thing that starts to get, well,

Stoney   
you have the freedom to speech, but that doesn't mean you were free from the consequences that can come to some of that correct. Because if you say something about my wife,

Ian  
I know

Stoney   
I'm gonna

Ian  
knock you into next but what I'm saying is, like, if the government starts to try and find me for opinions that I have, that's the thing I'm talking about, where it's like, that's where we start getting into, like, okay, we're underneath a different political

Stoney   
Look at that. Oh, you hurt somebody's feelings. Oh, you bad person. Right now, they're just canceling you. What's the next step? But again,

Ian  
but we're still talking about, we're still talking about, like, communities. I'm not talking about the government, is the thing I'm talking about. Like, I don't think the government has ever come out and said we're canceling this person. The federal government, IRS, has said we're canceling this person. You know what I mean? Like, that's, that's where I'm saying. The difference comes in a community of people can cancel

Stoney   
you and what that's what he just said. The IRS was used to target,

Ian  
okay,

Stoney   
Catholics, and all of a sudden, a exorbitant amount of Catholics were getting audited because the Biden administration said, Oh, we don't like your stance on abortion, right? So it was, at the time, a tool being used. How far then, is it for the government to say we're going to go widespread with this and go against all Christian nationalists? Right? Not that far from it.

Ian  
I hear you,

Jason  
if it's

Stoney   
been used even in a small capacity, that's a test to see how much more we can get away with.

Ian  
What did the audits bring about? Was it just checking in on their financials, or was it?

Jason  
No, I'd have to pull it up. I do remember at the time when the FBI was actually going in undercover,

Ian  
okay,

Jason  
they were targeting what they call traditional Latin Mass capital,

Ian  
okay,

Jason  
generally, if you look at kind of the statistics on on the whole in this particular issue, the abortion issue, the most staunch within, you know the term Catholic, most staunch anti abortion are those Catholics that attend the traditional Latin Mass. So we call pre Vatican two Catholics,

Ian  
right?

Jason  
Those are the most conservative,

Ian  
yeah,

Jason  
Catholics out there. So those are the Catholics that attend Mass every week. You know, are very involved in church life. They kind of, you know, walk the walk, you know, talk about everything. So as as, as the numbers you skew from that for and you'll get in, you know, people that maybe only turn attend a religious service once a month.

Ian  
Yes, yeah,

Jason  
you know kind of how that data was

Stoney   
an Easter, right?

Jason  
Yeah, that's what I call the CEO people. But, but yeah. So I do remember the time that was a big deal. It made national news about what they were doing, and that's what I'm saying. So they utilize the IRS to target these groups, these nonprofits, and they were starting to investigate them as a pretense because of put pressure on them to tone down their rhetoric or to don't voice your opinion about this particular topic, and unfortunately, that's what they did so and that's what I'm saying, just how the government all it takes is a few people that are not kind of staying above the fray, so to Speak, take control of government systems, which includes surveillance, and in turn, target certain domestic groups that traditionally never would have even thought of surveilling those kind of people. I mean, it was just kind of unheard of, but today, because of surveillance has become so easy. We have so much, there's so much conditioning to it now, that we don't think nothing of it. We really don't, because we're being surveilled every single day. I know I'm being surveilled. I remember my mother got rid of Alexa in her house because she goes, Alexa was, you know, I didn't like the intrusion there? Yeah, some people, I remember when, when TVs came out with cameras on TVs.

Ian  
Yeah,

Jason  
you're being recorded. I People don't realize that,

Stoney   
right? Your TV even off, is still gathering information on

Jason  
you. So you're being recorded in everything you do. So I just think that. But you know, these things happen, just like in my intro, it kind of creeps up on you like a fog. It doesn't hit you. It just kind of just kind of easily, just kind of floats around you, and then not next thing, you know, you're deep in it. I mean, it's like, well, what the hell happened?

Ian  
There's a lot of things you can do. And I hesitate to say something that's gonna know that Stoney is gonna be against a lot of it. There are certain practices and things in place that you can do that can turn off certain settings and certain things on your phone, absolutely. We talked about this with our friend Brandon, who came on a bunch like that. You know, when it comes to my computer and how I do things like I said before, as far as like cookies are concerned, and browsing history and all this stuff like that, and being careful of what websites I go on to, I don't keep Location Services turned on my phone. And so it's like, it's all these kind of things that like, again, it's not perfect, because again, we live in the modern age. Like you said, you are being surveilled, whether you like it or not, and there are some things that I have opted out of that I do think make my life a little bit better. Am I still probably being surveillance way, probably, but I think I am making it harder for certain

Jason  
right

Ian  
companies and people to do that

Jason  
absolutely.

Ian  
And again, it's not a perfect system, but I have done my best to do that. So I mean, you know, the only time ever keep my location services on is when I'm using a if I am going of somewhere outside of my normal rotation, and I'm going into a new city, or I'm going to new state, and I'm going to use my maps or whatever then, but for the most part, I don't keep any of that stuff turned on. Well, when it comes to data privacy statistics, I've been I'm looking at this article by user centrics, and they kind of do a, kind of an overview of just kind of the, you know, data privacy and stuff like that. They say by the end of 2024, data protection laws covered 6.3 billion people, or 79% of the global population. These are Protection

Jason  
System Protection Systems. It goes out. So just as I'm saying, there's still, I still think there's still a robust kind of a pushback on some of this stuff. They said, as of beginning of 2025 there were 144 countries with data and consumer privacy laws. So 21 US states passed data privacy laws as of the beginning of 2025 that's 42% the EU imposed 2.1 billion in fines due to violations of the General Data Protection Regulation.

Stoney   
You got to think about that. That's the government trying to come in and say, Okay, you can't use your your data and monitoring. Do you know why they don't want you to do that? The same reason they don't want you killing and stealing is they don't like the competition. Okay, it's that simple. They don't want you doing it, but they're free to do it. Kind of what I said earlier. They're still going to do it. Their protection laws don't stop them from doing it. It only stops some company, supposedly from doing it, but yet they're still going to do it anyway.

Ian  
The EU has definitely done some work on trying to help consumers being able to repair their own equipment and

Stoney   
hmmm mmm

Ian  
lot of stuff like that.

Jason  
Yeah. I mean, there's we do beat the European Union up over a lot of things, and rightfully folks, I think sometimes they go overboard, but they do do some some good things, yeah? Well, they kind of screwed the pooch on that one.

Stoney   
Oh, they pass laws on safe food chemicals,

Jason  
yeah. So, I mean, I give them credit for that.

Stoney   
They got some things,

Jason  
it's kind of like a mixed bag. I think the more involved government

Ian  
is

Jason  
in things that can be good or bad, with food and regulating what sort of chemicals in food. I give the EU a lot of credit for holding these manufacturers, you know, feet to the fire when it comes to like,

Stoney   
oh, yeah FDA, when you started, was supposedly, you know, a great idea. When it started, it was the Food and Drug Administration to protect Americans that only lasted about six weeks before it got turned into something else. But they're not protecting any Americans right now. All they're doing is lying in people's pockets and people on that own, the the companies, the food and beverage companies, are on the you know, the council, the FDA Council, it's ridiculous.

Jason  
Yeah,

Ian  
that's most groups I feel like in America.

Stoney   
No, I yeah, that's, that's kind of the point. It's when it started six weeks it was great, and then all of a sudden, you put the wrong people in place, and now it's shit. It's they're not protecting any Americans, and that's the point. Their job is to protect the American citizen. Yeah. Well, time we got back to that,

Jason  
well, they said, you know, regarding this digital money, I know we've been talking a little bit about it, because I think this is part of surveillance, because ultimately, that's how you can control. I mean, once you control money, then, oh yeah, you control everything. At that point, said, in 2025 Congress passed and signed into law the genius act. I don't know if y'all familiar with that. Said it creates a federal framework for stable coins, digital dollars issued by private companies. It says it makes it illegal. It makes it illegal to issue certain digital currencies unless you're approved, that's that approved stuff, and then puts oversight across agencies like treasury, the Fed and banking regulators. So

Stoney   
it's just crypto is all it is, is stopping somebody from starting their own crypto, unless you want to play ball with us. Yeah.

Jason  
So, I mean, you know, this is kind of one of those things that just,

Ian  
yep,

Jason  
you know, I think we're, you know, at a point where it's

Ian  
a slippery slope. I feel like,

Stoney   
well, we're on that. We're on that slippery slope. I mean, look at what credit card companies were doing. They were reporting when you bought a weapon or ammunition. They can report on what you buy. Well, reporting on what you buy, they take that information, and all of a sudden they target you. You know, right? What are they doing with the information, even, even if you and I hate to use the weapon again, but if you go buy a weapon, you have to go through a background check, and they have to keep that copy for 10 years, and then it's supposed to be destroyed. And there's not a person on this planet that actually believes that's destroyed after 10 years. Now, it's all digital,

Ian  
right?

Jason  
Well, we are. We're here.

Ian  
Yeah,

Jason  
I don't know how to to get out of it and but I just think it's inevitable that we're going to have more cameras. I think people are after every terrible event. People are looking for more surveillance. And goes back, I think the statistics show that people, when certain pressures are placed, you're willing to give up just a little bit more, right? And well, especially

Ian  
if it comes to safety.

Jason  
Well, people look this goes back, though, this is what I was talking about, and this was illustrated perfectly when mondami was elected to New York. What did he say? They're going to get away from that rugged individualism, to embrace the warmth of collectivism. So this is appealing to I hate to say it weakened people that need the state to protect them. And I think shifting to that this sort the paradigm see this is where there's a there's a frame of thinking that's so different from what our founders envisioned America to be because they came from countries that were utterly controlled by monarchies couldn't do anything without the approval of the king. To this idea of I determine my own fate. I'm in charge of my own destiny.

Stoney   
I'm in charge of my own happiness.

Jason  
And I think this is where. I think this is where, unfortunately, what you're starting to see now, and I'm starting to see, I just saw an article about another mayor, very similar to mondami, that's probably going to get elected in Los Angeles,

Ian  
of course. So happen,

Jason  
this is what I'm talking about, but this is now more and more. The government is here to take care of you, and I think for those people, the temptation is to give in to that. It really is, because it's easy, but I

Ian  
think also sometimes I think we're I feel like right now, we're conflating personal security with like, you know, big brother government security. This was a lot of surveillance in my life that I feel like I'm okay with that. I'm like, I'm like, like I said before at my workplace, having a keypad entry, having cameras all around the stuff that is probably connected to internet and is being viewed probably, but at the same time, there's also a safety for that that comes into it that I'm okay with. Whereas, again, we're talking about, you know, do I trust the government to do some of that stuff? Probably not. But again, personal security, yes, but like I've said before about my home, keep. Ad, it's a keypad entry. So, I mean, I would rather that than having a key that someone could copy and steal and get into my house, like, which has happened in the past before with my family, or someone had gotten a hold of the key and copied it and gotten the house and stole stuff and like, okay, like, but now I have a code that I can give to a friend of mine, and I can put a schedule on it, and someone can get into my house or not. Obviously, anyone can break into your house. But, I mean, you know, yeah, anyone who's away, there's a will, yeah? But anybody who's an honest thief trying to get into the house, it's right, different So, but,

Jason  
well, I'm kind of going back real quick to to my ring doorbell stuff, 58 point 9, million US households, you video doorbells,

Ian  
right? And I think if people started to really realize what kind of probably data is being collected on, that there may be more, they may be less inclined to do that, but also the security of knowing that, like Whenever someone's home, or whenever, like if there's a stranger on the doorstep, or whatever, you can see that there's a little bit of security you feel in that that you do like. And some people are willing to purchase that and maybe sign away some level of anonymity, away to have that and and people are okay with that.

Jason  
61% of US households now have at least one security camera.

Ian  
Yeah,

Jason  
up from 52% 2024 today, about 74 point 9 million homes have indoor or outdoor security cameras.

Ian  
I don't have it currently, but at my home, I've thought about putting a camera out, like, out from the front porch, so I could see the, like, driveway, yeah, and the road out in front of my house. So if someone was to come home, or if someone was to drive up and I wasn't aware about it, or a package or whatever. I had video evidence of that, because there no one has broken into the house. But I have had some people that have, you know, I've got a driveway that, like, wraps around, so people, a lot of times

Stoney   
turn to turn around and

Ian  
go and Yeah, and I've had, and I've had some delivery trucks that have gotten stuck and, like, ruined the driveway. And it was like, well, it would have been nice to have had some

Jason  
sort

Ian  
of evidence of right, instead of now having to, I have to fix my yard or whatever, like that kind of stuff, but I haven't done it. But, you know, it's that kind of stuff, like, you know, who knows?

Jason  
Ai features are gaining traction. 28% of users already have aI person or package detection. I have to say, I'm one of those.

Ian  
Okay?

Jason  
And 39% they say. And 39% they want facial recognition.

Ian  
Of course,

Jason  
they said the benefit. And this goes back to, you know, Ian, what you were saying, the benefits of Home Security cameras for outweigh privacy concerns. Well, so while 37% worry about who might access their footage, 87% say home security increases their peace of mind.

Stoney   
There was a big article I saw the other day while I was researching this about license plate readers.

Ian  
Oh, yeah, yeah. And

Stoney   
a lot of neighborhoods have them. They're on if you if you're in a metropolitan area, every license you know, every light has one, yeah, but the abuse from law enforcement. There was one town that had 10 officers was looking at it, following their wives around, their exes around, get out or something. They were abusing the system. that's just a tiny bit of Yeah. And I'm like, wow. So

Ian  
again, I feel like

Stoney   
it sounds great that you can use that to, hey, we're going to have smarter lights, and traffic is going to go faster, and we're going to have all this, but now you got somebody, ooh,

Ian  
but that, but that's also anybody. That's anybody anywhere can there, once human beings are involved, there's probably someone who's going to either take advantage of it or put their grubby little hands on it. And so sometimes, again, I don't know, I feel like we can. It's one of those things where you can, what if I don't know you can. What if it to death, you can stay in fear and and say, No, I'm wondering

Stoney   
if we weren't little right past the what if error we're in the, okay, when's it really going to take us over

Ian  
Right? Right? Because

Stoney   
it's, it's kind of there, because that, you know, they even one of the guys just saw a girl on the camera, and he was following her around all the way home.

Ian  
That's creepy. That's crazy, though.

Stoney   
I'm like, wow,

Ian  
but, but again, if I'm not mistake, how do we know? How do we know about that? Did someone catch that person? Was it?

Stoney   
No, they were caught. They were caught and they're they're being dealt with.

Ian  
Of course, I don't know. So maybe, and

Stoney   
that's just the ones that got caught

Ian  
Exactly.

Jason  
Yeah? Well, the surveillance, the surveillance state, doesn't arrive with a knock, yeah, it arrives with a login, and by the time you realize who's watching, you're already part of the system,

Ian  
yep. So

Jason  
that's it for me.

Ian  
Well, for anybody who wants to let us know your two cents on the matter? Because I have a feeling there's some people out there that want to tell us something. We have an email address get offended together@gmail.com, where you can send long form responses. We also have comment sections on Spotify and YouTube where you can leave some more short form responses. Be sure to like and subscribe on whatever platform you listen to us on. We really appreciate it. Share it with someone who you think may like this or who may not like this, and when you want to get mad with because that'd be that'd be fun as well. Until next week. Thank you so much for listening. Bye, bye,

Jason  
goodbye everyone, and God bless

Stoney   
here's the part that should keep us awake. The control system of the future probably won't announce itself as tyranny. It won't show up with a black uniform, a barking order and a boot on the porch, it will come quietly. It will come as an update. Your City updates its traffic plan, your car updates its safety software, your store updates its pricing system, your phone updates its permissions, your bank updates its terms, your insurance company updates its risk model, the government updates its compliance rules. Every update will sound reasonable, for safety, for sustainability, for fairness, for efficiency, hey, even for your protection. Then one morning, somewhere down the road, a man walks outside with his keys in his hand, an ordinary man worries on his mind, work, bills, groceries, a doctor's appointment, a kid needing a ride, and the car won't start, not because the engine failed, because permission failed. Maybe the system says He looks tired. Maybe the insurance profile changed overnight. Maybe his payment didn't clear. Maybe his vehicle is outside an approved zone. Maybe his emissions allowance is exhausted. Maybe a software flag from somewhere deep in the cloud says restricted. Maybe nobody can explain it. Maybe the appeal takes 10 business days. Maybe the machine is wrong, but the machine does not care. That nightmare version of this future not a world where the government screams at you, a world where the system simply says no no explanation, no person, no argument, no mercy, just a screen, because the system will not knock it will not ask permission, it will simply update. And by the time most people realize the cage has been built, they may be standing inside it, holding a phone, staring at a screen waiting for approval to leave. You're the best. Thanks for hanging out with us today. Peace.